📅 Original date posted:2014-03-14
📝 Original message:Indeed, rounding is the obvious easy fix. Bitcoin Wallet rounds all
amounts except if you type amounts with a higher precision.
On 03/14/2014 04:32 PM, Mike Hearn wrote:
> The issue here is that most people are producing prices in BTC by just
> multiplying through the spot rate with full precision. Obviously if you
> converted dollar prices to Euro prices with the same technique, you'd
> also end up with lots of numbers after the decimal point, but in the
> real world nobody actually does this. They always "prettify" the price.
>
> This practice often annoys people because they feel like they get short
> changed. The most notorious example is Apple which likes (liked?) to
> charge 99 cents per iTunes song in the USA, and 99 pennies per song in
> the UK, despite that the British pound is worth a lot more than the
> dollar. It should be more like 60 pence.
>
> Nothing stops BitPay rounding the mBTC price to look more natural, but
> right now it's not common practice.
>
>
> On Fri, Mar 14, 2014 at 4:02 PM, Andreas Schildbach
> <andreas at schildbach.de <mailto:andreas at schildbach.de>> wrote:
>
> By that definition 3.56 is a price. Maybe I misunderstood you and you're
> lobbying for mBTC?
>
>
> On 03/14/2014 03:57 PM, Tamas Blummer wrote:
> > you miss the point Andreas. It is not about the magnitude but about
> > the form of a price.
> >
> > A number with no decimals or with two decimals is percieved as a
> > price in some currency.
> >
> > A number with more than two decimals is just not percieved as a price
> > but as a geeky something that you rather convert to local currency.
> >
> > Tamas Blummer
> > Bits of Proof
> >
> > On 14.03.2014, at 15:49, Andreas Schildbach <andreas at schildbach.de
> <mailto:andreas at schildbach.de>
> > <mailto:andreas at schildbach.de <mailto:andreas at schildbach.de>>> wrote:
> >
> >> How much do you pay for an Espresso in your local currency?
> >>
> >> At least for the Euro and the Dollar, mBTC 3.56 is very close to what
> >> people would expect. Certainly more familiar than µBTC 3558 or BTC
> >> 0.003578.
> >>
> >> Anyway, I was just sharing real-world experience: nobody is confused.
> >>
> >>
> >> On 03/14/2014 03:14 PM, Tamas Blummer wrote:
> >>> You give them a hard to interpret thing like mBTC and then wonder
> >>> why they rather look at local currency. Because the choices you
> >>> gave them are bad.
> >>>
> >>> I think Bitcoin would have a better chance to be percieved as a
> >>> currency of its own if it had prices and fractions like currencies
> >>> do.
> >>>
> >>> 3.558 mBTC or 0.003578 BTC will never be as accepted as 3558 bits
> >>> would be.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Tamas Blummer Bits of Proof
> >>>
> >>> On 14.03.2014, at 15:05, Andreas Schildbach
> <andreas at schildbach.de <mailto:andreas at schildbach.de>
> >>> <mailto:andreas at schildbach.de <mailto:andreas at schildbach.de>>>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> btw. None of Bitcoin Wallet's users complained about confusion
> >>>> because of the mBTC switch. In contrast, I get many mails and
> >>>> questions if exchange rates happen to differ by >10%.
> >>>>
> >>>> I suspect nobody looks at the Bitcoin price. It's the amount in
> >>>> local currency that matters to the users.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> On 03/13/2014 02:40 PM, Andreas Schildbach wrote:
> >>>>> Indeed. And users were crying for mBTC. Nobody was asking for
> >>>>> µBTC.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I must admit I was not aware if this thread. I just watched
> >>>>> other wallets and at some point decided its time to switch to
> >>>>> mBTC.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On 03/13/2014 02:31 PM, Mike Hearn wrote:
> >>>>>> The standard has become mBTC and that's what was adopted.
> >>>>>> It's too late to try and sway this on a mailing list thread
> >>>>>> now.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> On Thu, Mar 13, 2014 at 2:29 PM, Gary Rowe
> >>>>>> <g.rowe at froot.co.uk <mailto:g.rowe at froot.co.uk>
> <mailto:g.rowe at froot.co.uk <mailto:g.rowe at froot.co.uk>>
> >>>>>> <mailto:g.rowe at froot.co.uk <mailto:g.rowe at froot.co.uk>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> The MultiBit HD view is that this is a locale-sensitive
> >>>>>> presentation issue. As a result we offer a simple
> >>>>>> configuration panel giving pretty much every possible
> >>>>>> combination: icon, m+icon, μ+icon, BTC, mBTC, μBTC, XBT,
> >>>>>> mXBT, μXBT, sat along with settings for leading/trailing
> >>>>>> symbol, commas, spaces and points. This allows anyone to
> >>>>>> customise to meet their own needs beyond the offered default.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> We apply the NIST guidelines for representation of SI unit
> >>>>>> symbols (i.e no conversion to native language, no RTL giving
> >>>>>> icon+m etc).
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Right now MultiBit HD is configured to use m+icon taken from
> >>>>>> the Font Awesome icon set. However reading earlier posts it
> >>>>>> seems that μ+icon is more sensible.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Let us know what you'd like.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Links: m+icon screenshot: http://imgur.com/a/WCDoG Font
> >>>>>> Awesome icon:
> >>>>>> http://fortawesome.github.io/Font-Awesome/icon/btc/ NIST SI
> >>>>>> guidelines: http://physics.nist.gov/Pubs/SP811/sec07.html
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> On 13 March 2014 12:56, Jeff Garzik <jgarzik at bitpay.com
> <mailto:jgarzik at bitpay.com>
> >>>>>> <mailto:jgarzik at bitpay.com <mailto:jgarzik at bitpay.com>>
> >>>>>> <mailto:jgarzik at bitpay.com <mailto:jgarzik at bitpay.com>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Resurrecting this topic. Bitcoin Wallet moved to mBTC
> >>>>>> several weeks ago, which was disappointing -- it sounded like
> >>>>>> the consensus was uBTC, and moving to uBTC later --which will
> >>>>>> happen-- may result in additional user confusion, thanks to
> >>>>>> yet another decimal place transition.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Learn Graph Databases - Download FREE O'Reilly Book
> "Graph Databases" is the definitive new guide to graph databases and
> their
> applications. Written by three acclaimed leaders in the field,
> this first edition is now available. Download your free book today!
> http://p.sf.net/sfu/13534_NeoTech
> _______________________________________________
> Bitcoin-development mailing list
> Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net
> <mailto:Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net>
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Learn Graph Databases - Download FREE O'Reilly Book
> "Graph Databases" is the definitive new guide to graph databases and their
> applications. Written by three acclaimed leaders in the field,
> this first edition is now available. Download your free book today!
> http://p.sf.net/sfu/13534_NeoTech
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Bitcoin-development mailing list
> Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
>
Andreas Schildbach [ARCHIVE] /
npub1xg…adsv7
2023-06-07 17:15:27
in reply to nevent1q…de7h
Author Public Key
npub1xg2m84malu0cfm4444r0kysx4rgk27e75aj6sz6538kw8fcz627qeadsv7Published at
2023-06-07 17:15:27Event JSON
{
"id": "32fa0a7e1d044d812ab3a8ebac4aa28b503c90f5ddf7d2d5243646bad1bb62e7",
"pubkey": "3215b3d77dff1f84eeb5ad46fb1206a8d1657b3ea765a80b5489ece3a702d2bc",
"created_at": 1686150927,
"kind": 1,
"tags": [
[
"e",
"a5889b6003c7241c893062a271bfd01eb179b582d390c0baf2198e69cbfe2d2d",
"",
"root"
],
[
"e",
"c330cd348d6601eca73f3068be1ff42687d11289ced2bd43df92e5cc45890429",
"",
"reply"
],
[
"p",
"f2c95df3766562e3b96b79a0254881c59e8639f23987846961cf55412a77f6f2"
]
],
"content": "📅 Original date posted:2014-03-14\n📝 Original message:Indeed, rounding is the obvious easy fix. Bitcoin Wallet rounds all\namounts except if you type amounts with a higher precision.\n\n\nOn 03/14/2014 04:32 PM, Mike Hearn wrote:\n\u003e The issue here is that most people are producing prices in BTC by just\n\u003e multiplying through the spot rate with full precision. Obviously if you\n\u003e converted dollar prices to Euro prices with the same technique, you'd\n\u003e also end up with lots of numbers after the decimal point, but in the\n\u003e real world nobody actually does this. They always \"prettify\" the price.\n\u003e \n\u003e This practice often annoys people because they feel like they get short\n\u003e changed. The most notorious example is Apple which likes (liked?) to\n\u003e charge 99 cents per iTunes song in the USA, and 99 pennies per song in\n\u003e the UK, despite that the British pound is worth a lot more than the\n\u003e dollar. It should be more like 60 pence.\n\u003e \n\u003e Nothing stops BitPay rounding the mBTC price to look more natural, but\n\u003e right now it's not common practice.\n\u003e \n\u003e \n\u003e On Fri, Mar 14, 2014 at 4:02 PM, Andreas Schildbach\n\u003e \u003candreas at schildbach.de \u003cmailto:andreas at schildbach.de\u003e\u003e wrote:\n\u003e \n\u003e By that definition 3.56 is a price. Maybe I misunderstood you and you're\n\u003e lobbying for mBTC?\n\u003e \n\u003e \n\u003e On 03/14/2014 03:57 PM, Tamas Blummer wrote:\n\u003e \u003e you miss the point Andreas. It is not about the magnitude but about\n\u003e \u003e the form of a price.\n\u003e \u003e\n\u003e \u003e A number with no decimals or with two decimals is percieved as a\n\u003e \u003e price in some currency.\n\u003e \u003e\n\u003e \u003e A number with more than two decimals is just not percieved as a price\n\u003e \u003e but as a geeky something that you rather convert to local currency.\n\u003e \u003e\n\u003e \u003e Tamas Blummer\n\u003e \u003e Bits of Proof\n\u003e \u003e\n\u003e \u003e On 14.03.2014, at 15:49, Andreas Schildbach \u003candreas at schildbach.de\n\u003e \u003cmailto:andreas at schildbach.de\u003e\n\u003e \u003e \u003cmailto:andreas at schildbach.de \u003cmailto:andreas at schildbach.de\u003e\u003e\u003e wrote:\n\u003e \u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e How much do you pay for an Espresso in your local currency?\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e At least for the Euro and the Dollar, mBTC 3.56 is very close to what\n\u003e \u003e\u003e people would expect. Certainly more familiar than µBTC 3558 or BTC\n\u003e \u003e\u003e 0.003578.\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e Anyway, I was just sharing real-world experience: nobody is confused.\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e On 03/14/2014 03:14 PM, Tamas Blummer wrote:\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e You give them a hard to interpret thing like mBTC and then wonder\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e why they rather look at local currency. Because the choices you\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e gave them are bad.\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e I think Bitcoin would have a better chance to be percieved as a\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e currency of its own if it had prices and fractions like currencies\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e do.\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e 3.558 mBTC or 0.003578 BTC will never be as accepted as 3558 bits\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e would be.\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e Tamas Blummer Bits of Proof\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e On 14.03.2014, at 15:05, Andreas Schildbach\n\u003e \u003candreas at schildbach.de \u003cmailto:andreas at schildbach.de\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e \u003cmailto:andreas at schildbach.de \u003cmailto:andreas at schildbach.de\u003e\u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e wrote:\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e btw. None of Bitcoin Wallet's users complained about confusion\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e because of the mBTC switch. In contrast, I get many mails and\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e questions if exchange rates happen to differ by \u003e10%.\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e I suspect nobody looks at the Bitcoin price. It's the amount in\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e local currency that matters to the users.\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e On 03/13/2014 02:40 PM, Andreas Schildbach wrote:\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e Indeed. And users were crying for mBTC. Nobody was asking for\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e µBTC.\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e I must admit I was not aware if this thread. I just watched\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e other wallets and at some point decided its time to switch to\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e mBTC.\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e On 03/13/2014 02:31 PM, Mike Hearn wrote:\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e The standard has become mBTC and that's what was adopted.\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e It's too late to try and sway this on a mailing list thread\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e now.\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e On Thu, Mar 13, 2014 at 2:29 PM, Gary Rowe\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e \u003cg.rowe at froot.co.uk \u003cmailto:g.rowe at froot.co.uk\u003e\n\u003e \u003cmailto:g.rowe at froot.co.uk \u003cmailto:g.rowe at froot.co.uk\u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e \u003cmailto:g.rowe at froot.co.uk \u003cmailto:g.rowe at froot.co.uk\u003e\u003e\u003e wrote:\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e The MultiBit HD view is that this is a locale-sensitive\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e presentation issue. As a result we offer a simple\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e configuration panel giving pretty much every possible\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e combination: icon, m+icon, μ+icon, BTC, mBTC, μBTC, XBT,\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e mXBT, μXBT, sat along with settings for leading/trailing\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e symbol, commas, spaces and points. This allows anyone to\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e customise to meet their own needs beyond the offered default.\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e We apply the NIST guidelines for representation of SI unit\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e symbols (i.e no conversion to native language, no RTL giving\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e icon+m etc).\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e Right now MultiBit HD is configured to use m+icon taken from\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e the Font Awesome icon set. However reading earlier posts it\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e seems that μ+icon is more sensible.\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e Let us know what you'd like.\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e Links: m+icon screenshot: http://imgur.com/a/WCDoG Font\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e Awesome icon:\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e http://fortawesome.github.io/Font-Awesome/icon/btc/ NIST SI\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e guidelines: http://physics.nist.gov/Pubs/SP811/sec07.html\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e On 13 March 2014 12:56, Jeff Garzik \u003cjgarzik at bitpay.com\n\u003e \u003cmailto:jgarzik at bitpay.com\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e \u003cmailto:jgarzik at bitpay.com \u003cmailto:jgarzik at bitpay.com\u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e \u003cmailto:jgarzik at bitpay.com \u003cmailto:jgarzik at bitpay.com\u003e\u003e\u003e wrote:\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e Resurrecting this topic. Bitcoin Wallet moved to mBTC\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e several weeks ago, which was disappointing -- it sounded like\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e the consensus was uBTC, and moving to uBTC later --which will\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e happen-- may result in additional user confusion, thanks to\n\u003e \u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e\u003e yet another decimal place transition.\n\u003e \n\u003e \n\u003e \n\u003e ------------------------------------------------------------------------------\n\u003e Learn Graph Databases - Download FREE O'Reilly Book\n\u003e \"Graph Databases\" is the definitive new guide to graph databases and\n\u003e their\n\u003e applications. Written by three acclaimed leaders in the field,\n\u003e this first edition is now available. Download your free book today!\n\u003e http://p.sf.net/sfu/13534_NeoTech\n\u003e _______________________________________________\n\u003e Bitcoin-development mailing list\n\u003e Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net\n\u003e \u003cmailto:Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net\u003e\n\u003e https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development\n\u003e \n\u003e \n\u003e \n\u003e \n\u003e ------------------------------------------------------------------------------\n\u003e Learn Graph Databases - Download FREE O'Reilly Book\n\u003e \"Graph Databases\" is the definitive new guide to graph databases and their\n\u003e applications. Written by three acclaimed leaders in the field,\n\u003e this first edition is now available. Download your free book today!\n\u003e http://p.sf.net/sfu/13534_NeoTech\n\u003e \n\u003e \n\u003e \n\u003e _______________________________________________\n\u003e Bitcoin-development mailing list\n\u003e Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net\n\u003e https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development\n\u003e",
"sig": "72a99fdb97c2e20ba1bc0fea8b778d66783040ca9f713944bfe6306c25887645ed21058d6fc2119eb61706f633360d2c53ad75b12bfec4b83eafb7f1a86c7e81"
}