Brett Cannon

#Python core developer; dev manager for the Python experience for #Microsoft #VSCode (although opinions my own, etc., etc.); snarky #Canadian

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Last Notes

2024-08-17 00:08:12

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@npub1f6a…pnql So I take it you don't run pytest via `python -m pytest` but instead via `pytest`?

2024-06-23 02:16:36

Because I've been seeing a blog post going around about using `pkgutil.resolve_name()`, I wanted to let people know I have long term plans to deprecate `pkgutil` as it's APIs don't integrate well with importlib and the import system as it currently stands.
https://github.com/python/cpython/issues/64138

2024-04-02 23:57:50

For those of you who chose our baby showing up before we got agreement on a lock file standard, you were right. 😅 https://fosstodon.org/@brettcannon/112052305281270127
Thanks to the kid being so late, though (one day shy of 42 weeks), I have most of a PEP written and gotten feedback from select people already.
And before anyone asks, I don't plan to share photos, name, or gender publicly; I don't want to dictate his online presence. But I do suspect they will eventually attend a conf w/ us, so you can ask them yourself 😉

2024-03-28 02:12:30

When you're packing for a trip, what questions do you ask yourself to determine what to pack?
Our questions are:
- Who's going on the trip?
- What's the purpose of the trip?
- What's the weather going to be like?
- How are you travelling?
- What kind of accommodation?
- Travelling internationally?
- Will anyone be at home / do you need to prep the house?

2024-03-28 01:29:27

I hope a large economy like the EU introduces a carbon tariff and says Canada doesn't qualify for exemption because Saskatchewan isn't collecting its carbon pricing to embarrass Scott Moe.
I get that Moe thinks the consumer pricing is bad for people (even if people get more money than they pay in unless you're a massive polluter), but breaking federal law simply because you don't like it is a dangerous, jerk move.

2024-03-28 01:23:26

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@npub18sf…x6dg Already learned Lua. 😉
I do have a backlog of Star Wars series to watch (basically the animated shows that aren't Clone Wars).

2024-03-27 00:27:18

Waiting to become a parent has led me back to my old habit of relaxing by learning new programming languages.
First was Gleam, now its ReScript, and after that is Elixir.

2024-03-21 21:57:28

The David Suzuki Foundation has the same acronym as the Django Software Foundation. Hopefully this isn't as troublesome as the Pacific Salmon Foundation sharing an acronym with the Python Software Foundation.

2024-03-20 20:04:26

Heard quite the horror story yesterday from a friend about how TD is trying to shake them down for some money after trying to leave the bank. BMO -- the bank they are moving to -- has stuck up for them.
I'm also still very happy w/ Vancity.

2024-03-17 23:45:19

I don't think there's any new info in https://snarky.ca/state-of-wasi-support-for-cpython-march-2024/ for those that follow me here, but it's a status update for CPython and WASI up until I started my parental leave.

2024-03-13 23:49:14

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@npub12fn…v63r Who said they were happy most of the time? 😉
Thanks for the compliment!

2024-03-12 22:44:49

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@npub18sf…x6dg https://github.com/Textualize/rich-cli

2024-03-12 05:47:58

I just finished reading https://jacobian.org/2024/feb/16/paying-maintainers-is-good/ and all I can say is "hell yes!" (although admittedly I fall under the "Employed by Microsoft to work on Python" classification partially).

2024-03-08 23:34:34

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@npub18sf…x6dg It's a bit tricky since people can name their `.env` files anything and then set the file path. Plus there's what _we_ think is invalid and e.g. what your library you're using to load the file thinks is invalid. And this isn't even necessarily from editing and simply just from wanting the Python extension to use the file you already have.

2024-03-08 23:32:23

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@npub13r3…zaw5 I got it with keys, but it continues to hold up (although I'm probably going to swap out the Invisible Woman as her effect just hasn't been beneficial enough), especially with Pixie + Mobius since it means you **only** decrease costs on your cards.

2024-03-08 01:08:40

What?!? Cowboy Bebop and Overwatch?!?
https://www.theverge.com/2024/3/7/24093455/overwatch-2-cowboy-bebop-collaboration

2024-03-07 22:19:18

Please don't specify different dependencies in different files in the same version of a project. It makes locking dependencies more expensive and complicates standards (to the point that we may have to skip supporting Poetry-style locking, at least to start). Please use environment markers to have dependency variability.
Also please upgrade the version of your build back-end for metadata version 2.2 or newer when that support lands for static metadata in sdists (PyPI just turned on support).

2024-03-07 22:10:10

I still hate .env files and their lack of a standard

2024-03-07 02:03:54

What's going to happen first: I become a parent or there's agreement on the scope of lock files for Python?
https://discuss.python.org/t/lock-files-again-but-this-time-w-sdists/46593/256

2024-02-29 20:52:07

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@npub19q0…v4fn FYI you left an "e" out of that link

2024-02-29 20:03:12

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@npub19q0…v4fn Contribution where? Is there a GoFundMe or something?

2024-02-28 20:32:13

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@npub1afy…vctl Thanks for pointing out the press release! The stuff I found from the White House made no mentions of languages.

2024-02-28 19:23:09

#Python tip: do **not** require a virtual environment to be activated for your code to work.
Virtual environment activation is a development feature/perk and **not** required for the Python interpreter to work. If you need to execute some Python code using the same interpreter as the one that's running then you can always get the interpreter's path from `sys.executable`.

2024-02-27 20:16:22

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@npub1pg3…9a8a The "why" is to let people to choose what dependencies they want (e.g. choose an async framework that you prefer). Also when a dependency is an optional speed-up or feature boost (e.g. plug-ins for something using pluggy).
The "how" is either `try` statements around `import` statements or things like httpx or anyio which abstract out the details or pluggy to find things that were installed.

2024-02-27 20:02:07

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@npub1pg3…9a8a I don't understand the question. Are you asking about "things to remember" or "optional dependencies"? And wouldn't optional dependencies depend on what the library does? Or are you asking more about dev tools?

2024-02-22 20:32:46

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@npub12fn…v63r I've been enjoying it! I am running Linux, though, so I don't have a baseline for battery life to compare it to (coming from a Mac)

2024-02-22 20:19:15

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@npub1txc…ajj9 FYI I was waiting to share here until things got far enough along for there to be a PEP; guess Hugo beat me to it 😅

2024-02-21 22:36:21

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@npub1agr…df6d Whoever told you that is a liar

2024-02-20 22:19:01

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@npub1ked…62j2 That's fine, but I'm not sure why that warranted a comment?

2024-02-17 19:56:54

Does anyone know what it would cost to hire people to build a Linux browser? The folks behind Kagi are asking to potentially bring their Orion browser to Linux https://orionfeedback.org/d/6363-orion-for-linux/35

2024-02-15 23:51:04

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@npub18sf…x6dg It was for me as well until every time I launch it on Linux it triggered a pop-up about xdg-open and found the open issue that's a couple of years old.

2024-02-15 20:58:57

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@npub18sf…x6dg I want to pay for my browser so they stop giving me default search engines that are a pain to get away from

2024-02-09 00:08:16

After 2 years and introducing the concept of tiered platform support to #CPython , #WASI has reached tier 2!
https://peps.python.org/pep-0011/#tier-2
I'm obviously not done w/ all of this, but at least I don't have a moving target for testing stability.
And for those that care, this is for WASI 0.1 (nee preview 1) w/ WASI SDK 20 and Wasmtime running `-Spreview2=n`; WASI 0.2 support is on the TODO list.

2024-02-06 01:20:57

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@npub1anf…5ra4 Do you know about the trick of having git use the Windows credential manager in WSL?

2024-02-06 01:17:19

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@npub17sg…p3zu What would you like to see instead?

2024-02-06 01:06:05

When you say or ask for something regarding open source, add "for me" to the end of the sentence. If that makes it sound rude, then consider rephrasing.
Some examples to show some good and bad phrases I hear regularly:
- "I want this ... for me"
- "It's been a year; how is this not done yet ... for me"
- "I think this is important ... for me"
- "I think that's a good idea ... for me"
- "That should be easy to do ... for me"

2024-01-30 00:33:24

As a reminder, you pay for open source w/ kindness. Don't make demands (you can request), argue (you can have a pleasant conversation), or be mean (you can always just not say anything). Otherwise your "refund" for that open source you apparently "overpaid" for could consist of being called out for your behaviour, ignored, blocked, the OSS contributor walking away/burning out, or that code you were using being yanked off the internet.
https://snarky.ca/setting-expectations-for-open-source-participation/

2024-01-27 00:12:50

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@npub19q0…v4fn Andrea showed me a video the other day suggesting it's a millennial thing and Gen Z does it differently. 😅
Plus I have to keep up w/ Gen α soon, so this is all already dated for my needs 😉

2024-01-27 00:05:33

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@npub1286…2u0v Do note I didn't call out any specific ecosystems in my comment, so listing specific ones which do handle this doesn't negate my point; there are other ecosystems which you didn't list for which Python is compared against which don't have a solution to this problem, which I consider an unreasonable comparison to make.
This is also open source, so telling folks to be change they want to see happen isn't gatekeeping, but setting reasonable expectations.

2024-01-26 23:37:00

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@npub19q0…v4fn I don't know if I will ever stop thinking that when people make that heart sign I think they just snapped their fingers

2024-01-26 23:33:38

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@npub1nqh…tsyc I would assume you would say "I'm looking forward to pytest N", where N is greater than the current release. 😁

2024-01-26 01:47:23

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@npub1t4f…trr3 I've contemplated blogging about this, but it always comes up when I'm in a frustrated mood and it just feels like flamebait.

2024-01-26 01:46:30

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@npub1ca3…ymgf I contemplated it, but I knew I wasn't going to have the time to do it.
Yours looks good, though!

2024-01-26 01:43:12

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@npub1pg3…9a8a You mean https://kagi.com/search?q=site%253Akushaldas.in ? 😉

2024-01-26 01:37:08

New rule: you are not allowed to compare Python packaging to another ecosystem unless that other ecosystem regularly has to work with and ship C, Fortran, and Rust code as if it was native to the ecosystem.
Other new rule: you don't get to come in and say Python packaging needs to be entirely scrapped and started from scratch unless you're willing to do the work to make that happen; that work includes designing, coding, and getting the community on side w/ your plan.

2024-01-26 01:18:03

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@npub1te2…a322 I assume you want this for desktop and not just mobile (I have a solution for the latter thanks to CalDAV)?

2024-01-25 01:57:00

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@npub1rfk…r9nj Thanks for the suggestion! I added a paragraph to the post ar I too have found it useful.

2024-01-19 19:01:07

I can't tell you how immensely helpful it has been living a life where I don't expect my computer to start up the next day (I shut everything down at night).
It makes me sure that everything that needs to be backed up is. It also makes bootstrapping a new machine way easier and not a stressful ordeal (I also write down key steps at https://github.com/brettcannon/dotfiles#bootstrapping-a-new-machine so I don't get annoyed by forgetting something).

2024-01-17 02:18:19

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@npub1rg5…tdr8 any plans to merge it?

2024-01-16 20:32:26

There's a request for Python to support https://bford.info/cachedir/ and `CACHEDIR.TAG` files in `__pycache__`: https://github.com/python/cpython/issues/85253 .
Do people know how widely supported it is? It's one of those things where I don't want CPython pioneering this, but I also realize adding it will somewhat legitimize it.

2024-01-12 19:18:55

Thanks to everyone who took the poll at https://fosstodon.org/@brettcannon/111734026776329678 !
A few people voiced concerns of things being downloaded automatically, but since it would all be in /tmp I don't think it's a huge concern (plus I would expect a spinner so it wasn't silent).
I think if I had made the Python Launcher for Unix **just** find Python, I would go w/ the subcommand. But since I alseady made it lean into my workflow by doing "magical" things, I will probably go w/ implicit support (w/ some opt-out).

2024-01-10 21:40:48

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@npub19q0…v4fn ❤️
And I'm sure I will figure something out so I can still watch films, even if a single film takes me days.

2024-01-10 21:30:59

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@npub1f9u…m3s0 FYI no Canadian airlines fly that plane

2024-01-10 21:30:15

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@npub19q0…v4fn How does one apply for the compliment?

2024-01-09 00:51:51

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@npub18sf…x6dg Yep. This is why rich people dodging taxes seems silly. Same goes for objecting to a wealth tax.

2024-01-08 19:21:08

https://moonbase.lgbt/blog/minimum-wage-clock/ is rather enlightening/disheartening

2024-01-04 03:06:20

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@npub13a0…rjjk it's my opinion and there is no way they will be deprecated as that would break way too much code. It's just my API taste and I happen to have been around when they were added to the stdlib.

2024-01-04 01:35:37

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@npub13a0…rjjk Their use isn't discouraged if used appropriately. And I don't expect the SC to make some statement about it. Is this your way of requesting a blog post from me on the subject?

2024-01-04 01:29:51

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@npub18t0…9gfz I'm not sure what I'm supposed to get from this, especially since the goal is incorrect.

2024-01-04 01:26:37

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@npub1jx7…quth You won't ever get syntax for dataclasses probably; too much flexibility to easily express syntactically. Plus you won't get agreement on what would be needed even if you pared it down w/o having a stated goal (hence why I made this a small
target).

2024-01-04 01:20:33

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@npub1sys…ckr3 "Magic" as in how the PoC works, or if there was a `record` keyword how it related to e.g. classes?

2024-01-04 01:19:14

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@npub1anf…5ra4 You tell me. 😉 Seriously, if you don't see a benefit if that was syntax then you answered your own question.

2024-01-04 01:16:33

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@npub13a0…rjjk To be frank, you shouldn't be using named tuples in new APIs anyway. They are meant to help move old, tuple-based APIs to an attribute-based one, not to start w/ as they double your API surface (sequence and attribute).

2024-01-04 01:09:20

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@npub1afy…vctl This is why it's more of a PoC towards syntax.

2024-01-03 06:52:03

I have created an experiment `py-pip` CLI app/subcommand https://snarky.ca/an-experimental-pip-subcommand-for-the-python-launcher-for-unix/
It basically makes sure I always have a virtual environment and pip is up-to-date (via a single, global copy). I know both @npub1nqh…tsyc and @npub13s5…tk65 have lamented about issues this CLI app would solved for them.

2023-12-27 20:48:10

Announcing a proof-of-concept record type for Python https://snarky.ca/my-proof-of-concept-record-type/
If you happen to remember my struct syntax proposal, this is effectively implementing that idea via a function decorator. If there's enough positive feedback I will consider writing a PEP to propose this as syntax.

2023-12-24 23:06:09

Quick blog post on mousebender 2023.2 and an update on trying to standardize lock files (which is basically just saying I updated mousebender in October for PEP 714) https://snarky.ca/announcing-mousebender-2023/ .

2023-12-22 21:44:53

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@npub1lrv…kyyr That's the hope! 🙂

2023-12-22 21:41:47

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@npub1txc…ajj9 My guess is it's a bug in Pylance where they are not inferring project structure appropriately. Would you mind opening a bug with them? (I believe they have a "Report Issue" command just for Pylance, else https://github.com/microsoft/pylance-release .)

2023-12-21 20:12:43

I now expect a PyCon talk from @npub133n…rvxd in a couple decades on coding when you're older as a follow-up to his PyCon 2015 keynote (https://lwn.net/Articles/641779/) 😁
https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2023/dec/21/senior-runners-ultramarathons-wally-hesseltine-fred-hagen

2023-12-07 01:54:50

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@npub17gf…20ur https://snarky.ca/the-many-shapes-and-sizes-of-keyboards/ covers the journey and result.

2023-12-06 20:04:33

I got my new keyboard! There will be a blog post, but I will say that trying to learn an alternative to QWERTY is SLOW!

2023-11-14 23:31:11

How is GNOME these days? My #Framework laptop is shipping and I'm going to try running #Fedora on it and I haven't done GUI Linux desktop for a while. I could use a Fedora Spin, but if GNOME is working well these days I would rather simplify my life and not try to do something that isn't the most supported thing by the distro.

2023-10-21 02:27:22

I just announced my conditional acceptance of https://peps.python.org/pep-0723/ over at https://discuss.python.org/t/pep-722-723-decision/36763 . Hopefully this will make writing single-file scripts a much easier proposition for people when they want to reach for something not contained in the stdlib.

2023-09-28 02:28:03

The 2022 #Python developer survey is out! https://pyfound.blogspot.com/2023/09/python-developers-survey-numbers-for.html
Thanks to everyone who took the time to fill it in. I'm sure the Python in #VSCode team is not the only one who uses the data to help make product decisions.
Also thanks for voting us your #1 editor! 🙂

2023-09-26 21:59:59

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@npub1rtr…50dx Unfortunately the setting of exceptions is way more cumbersome than what DDG supports (plus I don't know if that applies to ad blocking or also cookie clearing?).

2023-09-26 20:11:36

I **really** want the duckduckgo browser for Linux. Since that doesn't exist, does anyone know of another browser with a similar mechanism as their burn button with the ability to make select sites burn-proof?
I'm using Vivaldi and am generally happy, but I really appreciate that burn feature.

2023-09-16 03:01:15

Does anyone set the `PYTHONHOME` environment variable? I'm trying to determine how important it is to support in an API.

2023-09-16 02:58:56

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@npub19q0…v4fn Just realized we are **two** seasons behind instead of just one. 😅

2023-09-12 02:29:32

Slightly odd question, but would people find it useful to have a function that created a dict that you could `|` with `os.environ` to get the same environment changes that a virtual environment's activation script would do (sans prompt)?
I feel like I have been asked a couple of times now how to make `subprocess.run()` work like a virtual environment was activated, but I also feel like I might have temporal bias based on a question I got today.

2023-08-22 22:32:57

When do you think a spoiler embargo is lifted for a TV show or film?
My gut feeling is one month after hitting non-rental streaming services or 3 months, whichever happens first.

2023-08-22 01:14:31

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@npub1kj6…ncml @npub1vpf…833t Oh, and I might suck @npub17kp…qhjg in as well for help 😁

2023-08-21 23:35:23

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@npub1kj6…ncml Keep `packaging` running while I'm distracted with this. 😉
In all seriousness, thanks for the offer and I may bug you and @npub1vpf…833t about resolver details when the time comes.

2023-08-21 23:32:39

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@npub134x…4mlu I don't even know what "PDM's approach" is, so I guess without any inspiration? But I am going to use resolvelib as I have zero interest in writing a resolver from scratch.
There's also the issue of simply resolving in a way that people expect, so I don't think trying to be unique here is beneficial.

2023-08-19 02:35:44

I wrote a blog post giving an update on where my work towards creating a standardized lock file format for #Python projects currently stands: https://snarky.ca/state-of-standardized-lock-files-for-python-august-2023/ .
The `packaging.metadata` stuff I posted about earlier today was one of the steps in this project. Next up is a flexible resolver!

2023-08-18 21:00:59

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@npub1pe4…l44s @npub1084…ezwu @npub1nqh…tsyc Have you found the article view -- i.e., stripping out everything but text and pertinent images -- better than Pocket?

2023-08-15 00:59:29

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@npub1cfl…jgxe You don't _need_ any of them. It's just a question of whether you think they help make your workflow easier.

2023-08-15 00:58:33

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@npub16rc…syxc First off, don't think of it in terms of whether the lists contents will be different, but in terms of the intent of the contents.
But it could very well be different as you might set an upper version limit or a pinned version for your code while you never want that for a wheel you providing to others.

2023-08-12 01:43:47

I wrote a blog post to try and mentally separate the purposes of writing down dependencies of your package that's going to end up in a wheel, and the dependencies you need for your code to run: https://snarky.ca/differentiating-between-writing-down-dependencies-to-use-packages-and-for-packages-themselves/

2023-08-11 19:57:48

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@npub1xd8…8qee @npub1pfe…e2dm ... for which we are actively working on a way to embed your 3rd party dependencies list in your script so that tooling can create a virtual environment on the fly and install what's necessary to run that code on-demand (PEPs 722 and 723 are the current result of that discussion, but see discuss.python.org's Packaging section for all of it)

2023-08-01 23:52:48

If I were to say that the input you provide to pip-tools is input to the resolver to figure out what to install into your environment (i.e. `requirements.in`), and the output is a lock file (i.e., `requirements.txt`), does that explanation of what the purposes of those files are make sense to people (and specifically the `requirements.in` explanation)?

2023-06-25 03:10:25

This is rather specific, but for anyone using #NextDNS and @npub1n0m…z5ld on ChromeOS and you are getting a `DNS_PROBE_FINISHED_BAD_SECURE_CONFIG` error, do **not** change your DNS server for your network connection to the IPv6 address. You **can** still update your "Secure DNS" setting under "Network" to NextDNS' DoH which will still lead to NextDNS being used.